(Replying to PARENT post)

This is a forefront issue that Buddhism tries to address, both modern pragmatic Buddhism and fundamentalist Buddhism. It's why right speech, right action, and morals is one of the first things they drill into you. Most pragmatic practitioners will refuse to teach you if you indicate that you have some mental problems or moral deficiencies that should be addressed by a professional first, as mindfulness may end up doing more harm than good. It's one of the flaws of teaching secular mindfulness, far from its Buddhist roots. I've experienced all these interpersonal deficits after meditating seriously 2 hours every day for 2 years straight. Just need to have the self-awareness to address them, despite the goal of no-self.

I saw a Dr. K video in another comment, and one of my favorite quotes he uses to describe meditation is that, "if you run for 5 miles a day, there will be changes to your body that will definitely happen".

More here:

- https://www.mctb.org/mctb2/table-of-contents/part-i-the-fund...

- https://eudoxos.github.io/cfitness/html/index.html

- https://themindfulgeek.com/ plus a talk he gave at Google https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s2xxsA9Bn-4

👤jackdawed🕑3y🔼0🗨️0

(Replying to PARENT post)

There's a balance to be struck with anything. On the one hand, teaching meditation outside of the context of religion might increase the likelihood of the purpose of the practice being misunderstood. On the other hand, any religious practice runs the risk of breeding a sense of self righteousness in the practitioner. With meditation and mindfulness, I've seen both.

Also, I gotta say that language like "moral deficiencies" sounds incredibly broad without some examples. I think that speaks to the drawbacks of a religious context. I don't necessarily mean to direct these comments at you in particular (after all, I don't know what you meant by "moral deficiencies" without more info), but morality is a slippery topic and religion often seems to treat it like it isn't.

👤davesque🕑3y🔼0🗨️0

(Replying to PARENT post)

It's interesting that Western Christianity has pretty much the same underlying message - you simply can't reach salvation and union with God without starting from right morals. (This might be why Stoicism with its meditative and contemplative traditions, and a similar focus on divinely-inspired "right/moral action" was a key ally of early Christianity.) Islam of course has its own Sufi traditions, the Biblical prophets are said to wander in the desert etc. etc.
👤zozbot234🕑3y🔼0🗨️0

(Replying to PARENT post)

> I've experienced all these interpersonal deficits after meditating seriously 2 hours every day for 2 years straight.

Wow! I haven't meditated before. That sounds like a lot of time.

Do you still meditate? What does it offer you? Has it offered you what you expected?

👤danuker🕑3y🔼0🗨️0

(Replying to PARENT post)

A related talk by my favorite Buddhist teacher, Ajahn Sona, on 'Right Mindfulness'.

https://youtu.be/JOcoynQCmZ0

Highly recommend his channel by the way.

👤jmfldn🕑3y🔼0🗨️0

(Replying to PARENT post)

And yet no one who read the article, or commented the crap, even thought for a moment that humans have already contemplated these slivers.
👤StopDarkPattern🕑3y🔼0🗨️0

(Replying to PARENT post)

Mindfulness/meditation are tools to attain a level of awareness so that one can recognize what are the things holding one back from experiencing supreme peace and bliss. Without working on virtues like compassion, kindness, truthfulness, humility etc. these tools will only aggrevate one's selfish nature. There are countless examples from ancient India where advanced meditators obtained divine boons due to their severe penance (by meditation on the divine), but ended up using the boon for expansion of their power/wealth at the cost of others, thereby becoming extremely selfish and a problem for the society to sustain properly.
👤TriNetra🕑3y🔼0🗨️0

(Replying to PARENT post)

Forefront? HA! My experience is diametrically opposite: prolong Buddhism practice often leads to ego-centric behaviors that are swept under the rug and not talked about.

I was warned about it when I started getting "serious" about my practice, but I didn't believe it until I confronted it, face-to-face, on a daily basis. To this day I am the renegate and persona non grata at my Temple, ex except for the Abbot and my Zen Master who know how to tolerate, navigate, and leverage that BS for the greater good.

Samurai training is Buddhism training on steroids.

Regardless, my practice continue with a lot less time at the Temple, and I have relinquished my Center (the Center that I founded).

👤SMAAART🕑3y🔼0🗨️0

(Replying to PARENT post)

Are you sure that right things and morals have anything to do with Buddhism or meditation? For "serious meditators" - seriousness is one of the first things one drops when practices start working.
👤mapcars🕑3y🔼0🗨️0

(Replying to PARENT post)

Funny. My former psychiatrist recommended mindfulness to all his patients.

Always thought it was faddish.

👤pyuser583🕑3y🔼0🗨️0

(Replying to PARENT post)

what would you say are examples of harm done by dedicated meditation practiced by people with moral deficiencies?
👤2-718-281-828🕑3y🔼0🗨️0