(Replying to PARENT post)

"At least 80% of fibre-optic cables globally go via the US. This is no accident and allows the US to view all communication coming in. At least 80% of all audio calls, not just metadata, are recorded and stored in the US. The NSA lies about what it stores."

I think he meant that the NSA had access to the 80% of calls that are routed through the US, not the the NSA is recording and storing literally every single one of them. I think he was misquoted or misspoke.

William Binney hasn't worked for the NSA since 2001. Were they recording all calls back then? Did someone still there leak new information to him?

πŸ‘€eliπŸ•‘11yπŸ”Ό0πŸ—¨οΈ0

(Replying to PARENT post)

We're staring at the gradual but deliberate end of privacy and its scary. The large majority of the world's population either doesn't know or care how significant or dangerous this trend is, and those few who do will find their way into surveillance databases because they act "suspiciously" by encrypting their communications and guarding their privacy.

I don't see a powerful enough counterforce against this insidious trend anywhere around the world. "Inspired" by the US, other countries are joining a competitive surveillance race stoked by private corporations selling everything from GSM monitoring to big data.

</rant>

πŸ‘€r0h1nπŸ•‘11yπŸ”Ό0πŸ—¨οΈ0

(Replying to PARENT post)

The story in the Guardian by Antony Loewenstein certainly reports that William Binney's personal opinion as a former employee of NSA is that NSA is gathering up and recording whatever it can and that NSA has a "totalitarian mentality." That is a very important issue, if true, but it is at least debatable that NSA is really that thorough in its actual practices and really that generally blatant in disregarding the civil rights of Americans or even of people in other countries. For one thing, Binney also points to NSA intelligence failures in the same article, and if NSA is missing major activities of other countries (the Russian intervention in Ukraine) and nonstate terrorist groups (the "Islamic State" capture of much territory in Iraq), then surely NSA doesn't have the time and resources to analyze all of the data it gathers, and maybe it is not gathering as much data as some people claim.

Several comments posted before I read all those comments and read the fine article write about NSA blackmailing politicians. I don't believe NSA blackmail can or will happen in general, for reasons I have mentioned before here on HN. One of the most common kinds of comments here on Hacker News about issues like this is a comment that ASSUMES that if government leaders are under pervasive surveillance they are all afraid of blackmail. But I don't believe that, because some government leaders and some political candidates are essentially shameless. Even after they are caught (by old-fashioned journalism, or by a jilted lover or some unrelated criminal investigation) doing something unsavory, they are still willing to run for office, and SOME ARE REELECTED. United States Senator David Vitter was reelected in 2010 even after a scandal involving behavior that I would consider shameful,[1] and the antics of former DC mayor Marion Barry[2] are probably still notorious enough that they don't need further discussion here. In short, I call baloney on the idea that NSA can keep politicians on its leash simply by knowing their secrets. Some politicians have PUBLIC lives full of dirt, and still get elected and influence policy anyway.

The other reason I don't believe this HN hivemind theory of politics is that I by no means assume that everyone in politics lacks personal integrity. Some politicians, I am quite sure, could have all their secrets revealed only to have voters think "Why is that person such a straight-arrow? Why not have some fun once in a while?" The simple fact is that there is value system diversity in the United States electorate, and there is personal conduct probity variance among United States politicians, and there isn't any universal way to unduly influence politicians merely through even the most diligent efforts to discover personal secrets. If politicians think that NSA is going too far (as evidently several politicians from more than one party do think), then they will receive plenty of support from the general public to rein in the surveillance. (Obligatory disclaimer: Yes, I am a lawyer, who as a judicial clerk for my state's Supreme Court used to review case files on attorney misconduct, and, yes, some of my law school classmates are elected officials, including one member of Congress. I am absolutely certain that there are enough politicians ready to mobilize to roll back NSA surveillance programs if they really think the programs are excessive in their scope.)

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Vitter#D.C._Madam_scanda...

[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marion_Barry#1990_arrest_.26_d...

πŸ‘€tokenadultπŸ•‘11yπŸ”Ό0πŸ—¨οΈ0

(Replying to PARENT post)

The land of the free and the home of the brave. Indeed.
πŸ‘€PeterisPπŸ•‘11yπŸ”Ό0πŸ—¨οΈ0

(Replying to PARENT post)

If this is legal, is legality meaningless?
πŸ‘€dbpokornyπŸ•‘11yπŸ”Ό0πŸ—¨οΈ0

(Replying to PARENT post)

Between at least 80% and 100% lies the possibility, that this figure is even closer to 100% than anyone would love to admit...
πŸ‘€spacefightπŸ•‘11yπŸ”Ό0πŸ—¨οΈ0

(Replying to PARENT post)

"Thank you for using the Influencing Machine. This call may be recorded for training purposes."
πŸ‘€lotsofmangosπŸ•‘11yπŸ”Ό0πŸ—¨οΈ0

(Replying to PARENT post)

β€œThe ultimate goal of the NSA is total population control”

Scary shit...

πŸ‘€drcodeπŸ•‘11yπŸ”Ό0πŸ—¨οΈ0

(Replying to PARENT post)

Why is this economically insane bullshit on HN? Who is assumes to pay for this?
πŸ‘€_pmf_πŸ•‘11yπŸ”Ό0πŸ—¨οΈ0

(Replying to PARENT post)

But here's the rub - who still uses audio calls? Its a point of deminishing intelligence. That's like saying that 80% of all 8-tracks are now in 1970 cars (as a statement in 2014). Its just not relevant.
πŸ‘€JohnnyBuffaloπŸ•‘11yπŸ”Ό0πŸ—¨οΈ0

(Replying to PARENT post)

There have been at least 15-20 trillion constitutional violations

It is an amusing, even throwaway line, but it has a horrific message - the US administration is happy to sail so close to the line of totalitarianism that it will possibly violate the constitution a trillion times. In the UK we jus found out similar legislation is unconstitutional and we are hurriedly writing another law to get round it. _sigh_

What happens when a country that really cares about it's constitution has to rush an amendment through or face civil rights violations from everyone?

πŸ‘€lifeisstillgoodπŸ•‘11yπŸ”Ό0πŸ—¨οΈ0